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Episod 3
1:21:04

Winning’s A Losing Game with Ross Rebagliati | Legacies Podcast Episode 3

Tom and Wes chat with Olympic gold medalist Ross Rebagliati about the Nagano 1998 controversy and his venture, Ross’ Gold Cannabis.
EPISODE SUMMARY

Short Summary

Hosts Tom Ritchie and Wesley Bowles explore the financial and operational realities of the regulated Canadian cannabis market. Highlighting the federal government’s call for $200+ million in outstanding, unpaid excise taxes alongside simultaneous tax relief for the alcohol sector, they analyze how high tax rates and operational inefficiencies affect standard operations. Tom, drawing on Six Sigma manufacturing principles, emphasizes that tax relief alone cannot salvage poorly optimized operations and retail marketing deficiencies. The hosts also review Rizzlers vape products, discuss retail dynamics, and coordinate giveaways for Kintore Coffee and CannaKickIt.

The guest of the episode is Ross Rebagliati, the pioneering Olympic gold medalist who won the first-ever giant slalom snowboarding event at the 1998 Winter Olympics in Nagano, Japan. Ross shares a detailed account of the Nagano controversy, during which he was interrogated by Japanese police and briefly stripped of his medal after testing positive for THC. He details the severe personal and financial toll of the incident—which caused him to lose major corporate endorsements, delay processing his victory for ten years, and live flat broke in Whistler while his public profile remained massive.

Finally, Ross discusses his entrepreneurial pivot into the legal market by founding Ross’ Gold Cannabis. He details the brand’s premium cultivars (including Nagano 98, Black Diamond, Red Chair, and Organic Mango Gold) and their distribution across British Columbia, Ontario, and Quebec. Ross explains how he navigates Health Canada’s celebrity promotion restrictions by framing Ross’ Gold as an authentic cannabis story, and outlines the supply chain challenges of relying on micro-producers who face production volume bottlenecks for central provincial distribution boards.

FULL TRANSCRIPT

Intro & The Wizard (00:00)

Tom Ritchie Says: Hey, what’s going on, everyone? We’ve got a great show for you this week: Ross Rebagliati is joining us! You don’t want to miss it. Check out what’s coming up this week on Legacies.

Tom Ritchie Says: Welcome to Legacies. I’m your host, Tom Ritchie, joined as usual by Wesley Bowles. Wes, we’re going to start with “Wizard,” just so you know.

Wes Bowles Says: That’s “Wesley The Wizard Bowles”! The trend appears to be catching on, so I’ll stick with it. I’m not buying a hat, though.

Tom Ritchie Says: Run with it, run with it! This week, I’ve been stoked for this for a while: we’ve got Ross Rebagliati on, and we’re going to once and for all have him clarify how you say his last name, because I’ve heard it four different ways and I want to hear from the man himself!

Tom Ritchie Says: Not just being joined by Ross—Ross has a mini-documentary out, a short film that has made its way around various international film festivals. And we have Chris Roussakis as well, co-founder and creative director at Phantom Productions. He’s joining us partway through Ross’s segment. Ross is such a cool, humble dude.

Wes Bowles Says: Yeah, watching that documentary already… it’s a short documentary, but what they package into so many minutes is heart-wrenching.

Tom Ritchie Says: Heart-wrenching! We’ll unpack that, and we’re going to get into more background of his story. We’re going to try and condense this a little bit because we want to spend as much time as we can with Ross. First of all, I’m not seeing a lot of new products out there this week that I want to jump on, and I don’t know if it’s just because of distraction.

Rizzlers Vape Chatter & Reddit Reactions (02:18)

Tom Ritchie Says: Typically you or some of the team will send it to us—either Ryan or Ian. There was some more banter throughout the interwebs on the Rizzlers vape.

Wes Bowles Says: Yeah, we saw some comments on some Rizzlers posts about that new vape format we talked about last week. Some people don’t seem thrilled about it being a clone.

Tom Ritchie Says: I’ve never seen negative consumer feedback on Instagram and Threads like that. Usually Instagram posts are fairly fluffy with positive vibes for the community.

Tom Ritchie Says: Like you said, when you sent that over, I was like, whoa, I’ve never seen people respond like this on Instagram! Usually the subreddits blast different brands and companies.

Wes Bowles Says: Yeah, Reddit allows you to be anonymous, and Instagram not so much, so I think that plays a part in it too. But we also know the people following a lot of these companies and brands on Instagram—it’s the same kind of circle of people for the most part.

Wes Bowles Says: With the nature of Instagram being fairly restricted with profiles, it’s hard to reach newer audiences for cannabis companies. But because of that close circle, it tends to be fairly positive for the most part.

Tom Ritchie Says: Motif Labs is a good company. Brian over there and the team seem to do really well with some of the products they put to market, so hopefully it picks up and it works. I personally haven’t tried it. There was some feedback about 510s never going away—it’s the industry standard, and we can’t necessarily consider refillable due to the THC limit. We appreciate Scott from Greenhouse chiming in and giving us feedback on that.

Tom Ritchie Says: Regardless of the platform you catch us on, leave a comment! If you’re able to inform the audience or correct us, we appreciate that. Thanks, Scott.

Wes Bowles Says: Yeah, thanks, Scott. And again, it’s a new vape format, and no one likes change, especially when a standard has been around for so long. You’ve got to give Motif and Rizzlers kudos for at least trying to push the envelope. If they feel change is needed in the vape cartridge arena, good on them for pushing that. Maybe that leads to something bigger and more impactful.

Tom Ritchie Says: At the very least, it’s stirring up conversation and people are talking about Rizzlers. All news is good news, right?

Wes Bowles Says: Yeah, all news is good news regardless of what it is.

Tom Ritchie Says: It’s got three weeks of traction here on Legacies! Now I’m going to have to go out and buy this just to try it. But I think there’s a watermelon flavor—I hate fake watermelon everything! It’s the same with fake strawberry—too much.

Excise Tax Struggles & Federal Inequity (05:55)

Tom Ritchie Says: We don’t want to be the bearers of doom and gloom and bad news all the time, but the cannabis industry has suffered yet another black eye. Minister Freeland, as Deputy Prime Minister and Finance Minister of Canada… when the company was not doing what the public wanted, that rolls up. An announcement came out that the Liberals are providing relief to breweries and brewers across Canada.

Tom Ritchie Says: Originally I caught the post on LinkedIn Sunday morning by our good friend Jonathan Wilson over at Crystal Cure. I saw the invite to have Minister Freeland join Crystal Cure for a vape sesh! The cannabis industry has been screaming for some sort of relief basically since its inception. Lots of money spent, and they provide relief to brewers and now wineries.

Tom Ritchie Says: David Brown did a great job at StratCann. David, we want you on the show, man! Respond to some emails, get out here for us!

Wes Bowles Says: I’d like to see him out here for sure.

Tom Ritchie Says: Some statistics: according to Stats Canada in 2022, breweries employed nearly 23,000 Canadians. In contrast, Deloitte reported in 2021 that the cannabis industry directly employs 43,000 individuals, with 180,000 indirect jobs created in the first three years! The cannabis industry generates far more revenue than the beer industry.

Wes Bowles Says: Originally it would have been just beer, but they did announce shortly after that the wine industry is also getting a break as well.

Tom Ritchie Says: In this case: excise tax. And love him or hate him, Rob McPherson…

Corporate Efficiency: Not A Cure For A Badly Run Business (09:41)

Tom Ritchie Says: Rob McPherson—we see him on LinkedIn a lot, former president of Bacardi Canada, dude’s been at Bacardi and KPMG. We find the majority of his posts quite enlightening. Rob pointed out: excise tax relief is not a magic bullet, and he’s right. As an old asset manager working in a steel factory, I was a Six Sigma guy. I understood efficiencies, and I could go into some of these facilities and say: they’re not going to make it, they need to get way more efficient in their operations.

Tom Ritchie Says: Rob pointed out that excise tax won’t save all these companies. There’s a certain amount that would benefit, but do they understand marketing? A lot of them hit the wall because of regulations and go, “What the fuck am I going to do?” That’s not the case. Excise tax relief will not solve everything. Companies still need to get more efficient, and certain companies are still squandering investor money. It’s like Matthew McConaughey in The Wolf of Wall Street: “It’s a fugazi, it’s gone!”

Wes Bowles Says: There’s companies who are already in the shit money-wise, and then for them to also be purchasing other companies who are also badly run… two wrongs don’t make a right!

Tom Ritchie Says: It’s still a massive issue.

Wes Bowles Says: It was a one-two, maybe three punch over the course of the last week. Not only was the alcohol industry getting tax relief when they’re already taxed way lower—around 2% for most of these alcohol brands—at the same time, the government announced they were making the call for that outstanding $200 million in excise tax owed by cannabis brands to be paid immediately!

Tom Ritchie Says: You’re ignoring the calls in the cannabis space and demanding that all $200-plus million be paid back immediately!

Wes Bowles Says: And none of that excise tax money is earmarked for anything—it’s all general revenue. None of it is earmarked for healthcare, education, or social services. They just throw it in the general bucket.

Tom Ritchie Says: Shout-out to Jonathan Wilson at Crystal Cure. He had a video breaking down every 28-gram bag sold: approximately $65 goes directly to tax! Jonathan, we definitely want to have you on the show. And an open invite to Rob McPherson as well. This is a no-filter zone. When something pisses us off, we’re definitely going to call it out, and this pisses us off. It’s ridiculous.

Wes Bowles Says: We don’t want to be the kind of platform that avoids certain areas just for the sake of not upsetting people.

Tom Ritchie Says: We’re not Howard Stern, but I’m not afraid! I used to listen to Howard four or five hours a day with all my commuting. Love that guy.

Kintore Coffee Giveaway (15:31)

Tom Ritchie Says: Let’s move on from that. I’m going to pour coffee. I’ve got my French press beside me.

Wes Bowles Says: Would this coffee happen to be from Kintore Coffee?

Tom Ritchie Says: You got it! Todd over at Kintore Coffee. The coffee is fantastic, the only coffee vendor we currently have on thehighflyer.ca. And Todd has agreed to do a giveaway for us! We’re becoming the Oprah Winfrey of the cannabis industry—just giving shit away! “You get some coffee! You get some coffee!”

Tom Ritchie Says: Todd has agreed to give away a couple of bags of coffee and a t-shirt to one lucky winner. You’ve got to be following Kintore Coffee and following Legacies, tag a friend, and tell us why you enjoy coffee.

Wes Bowles Says: I had their cold nitro brew last week. My god, it’s so good!

Tom Ritchie Says: If shipping wasn’t a nightmare, I want that on the shelf! But you can find Kintore Coffee on thehighflyer.ca with shipping across Canada. Check out their Blue Collar blend—it’s incredible.

Wes Bowles Says: We’ve got four varieties from them on the shop right now: Backcountry light roast, Rustic blend medium roast, they have a decaf option, and the Blue Collar.

Tom Ritchie Says: Decaf… all coffee companies need to offer it, but I look at that like non-alcoholic beer. I don’t really drink alcohol anymore at all.

Wes Bowles Says: You drink non-alcoholic beverages now?

Tom Ritchie Says: I do, yeah. Alcohol is poison to the body. If I’m going to drink a couple socially, why does it need alcohol? If I want a buzz, I prefer cannabis. When I drink two beers, the next day I feel hungover.

Wes Bowles Says: Like The Wolf of Wall Street with Jonah Hill: “You want one of these beers?” “It’s non-alcoholic! What do you mean?!”

Tom Ritchie Says: When they took Quaaludes off the market, that was heartbreaking! [laughs] All right, what else have we got going on?

Wes Bowles Says: I think we should keep this first part kind of short because our interview with Ross might go long, and there’s a ton to discuss.

Tom Ritchie Says: There is so much! We’re going to bring Chris Roussakis in when we get to Nagano Till Now. I’ve seen it twice now—it’s phenomenal.

CannaKickIt Ticket Giveaway (21:12)

Tom Ritchie Says: Our friends over at CannaKickIt have some really cool events planned for April, May, and July. Check the comments for details to enter to win a prize pack with two tickets to all the events! On May 4th, you can expect to see Ross Rebagliati and Chris Roussakis from Phantom Productions for a live screening of Nagano Till Now. Follow CannaKickIt, follow Legacies, and tag a friend!

Welcoming Ross Rebagliati (21:44)

Tom Ritchie Says: Welcome back, everyone! We’re joined by Ross Rebagliati—Canadian snowboard champion, Olympic gold medalist. Ross, thanks for joining Legacies, man! You’re a champ.

Ross Rebagliati Says: It’s an absolute pleasure, thanks for having me!

Tom Ritchie Says: We’ve got a lot to unpack: longtime cannabis advocate, your brand Ross’ Gold, Olympic gold champion, and Nagano Till Now.

Ross Rebagliati Says: We’ve got a bunch of stuff happening! The cannabis industry is constantly moving—the goalposts keep changing, and we’re trying to keep up.

Tom Ritchie Says: We’ll bring Chris Roussakis in as well to talk about Nagano Till Now. But I want to go back in history. I got up in the middle of the night to watch you win gold in ’98. Let’s go back pre-snowboarding: when did you first start strapping boards to your feet?

How It Began: From Ski Racing to Snowboard Prohibition (23:38)

Ross Rebagliati Says: I started off as a ski racer until I was 15 in 1987. My buddies came back from visiting family in Oregon with snowboards during snowboard prohibition in Canada—snowboarding wasn’t allowed on ski hills yet. We were skaters in Vancouver and wanted to skateboard in the winter. I quit ski racing, and my dad was so choked because of all the fundraising and chocolate bars sold for the ski club! I even spent a few days living at my girlfriend’s house in “snowboard exile” because my dad was so pissed! [laughs]

Tom Ritchie Says: Your parents put all that investment into ski racing, and then you shift. How good were you out of the gate on a snowboard?

Ross Rebagliati Says: We were just fooling around at local parks in Vancouver. Our woodwork teacher in high school let us make snowboards out of laminated plywood! We’d ride them on weekends, break them, and make stronger ones during the week. In 1987, we drove down to Mount Baker in Washington because they allowed snowboarding. In 1988, Blackcomb, Cypress, and Silver Star opened up. I taught myself—there were no instructors or snowboard shops.

Ross Rebagliati Says: That summer my mom put me in Craig Kelly’s World Freestyle Camp at Blackcomb. By the end of the camp, Craig offered to get me sponsored by Burton Snowboards! By 1990, I won the North American Championship—overall for Canada and America in racing and freestyle. In 1991, I moved to Whistler, coached at Craig’s camp, and got a wildcard onto the World Cup tour in Europe.

Ross Rebagliati Says: My first World Cup race in Austria, I got 80th place. I was completely shattered. I called my dad and said, “These guys are on another level, maybe I should come home.” My dad said, “No, stay and do your thing.” When I got back, my mom entered me in the legendary Mount Baker Banked Slalom. I was on a race board in a speed suit against Craig Kelly on a freestyle board with baggy pants, and I beat Craig Kelly by one-hundredth of a second! That win gave me the confidence to carry on. The next year in Bormio, Italy, I got 3rd in giant slalom, and eventually won the European Championships—the first non-European to win.

Tom Ritchie Says: At what point did cannabis enter the picture? What was your first experience?

Ross Rebagliati Says: In high school, around grade 10, my buddies got some hash and we did hot knives off the stove coil. My mom found my box of hot knives and I told her I was using them to melt P-Tex into my snowboard base! [laughs]

Ross Rebagliati Says: I didn’t really start smoking weed regularly until I moved to Whistler at 19. All the high-level athletes—pro mountain bikers and backcountry skiers—would smoke a joint in the morning before five-hour, 50-kilometer rides in the woods. It put you in the right mind space and helped you survive the endurance grind. On the World Cup tour, coaches and riders smoked weed. We’d hide weed in abandoned castles in Italy to cope with the isolation before cellphones or the internet existed.

Nagano 1998 & The Japanese Jail Cell (42:35)

Tom Ritchie Says: In 1998 at Nagano, you win the first-ever Olympic gold medal in snowboarding. Then reports surface about trace cannabis, they strip your medal, and you end up in a Japanese jail. How much time did you spend in jail?

Ross Rebagliati Says: I was in the Nagano police station for the day being interrogated while they processed me for prison. I was 26 years old, thinking about Ben Johnson in ’88, wondering if my career and life were completely over. The translator barely spoke English, and after four hours of interrogation, I just said, “I’m done talking.”

Ross Rebagliati Says: Right then, the police chief came into my cell and said, “We have to let you out. The decision was made to return your medal—we can’t keep an official Olympic gold medalist in jail.” Walking into the lobby, the Canadian Olympic Association and RCMP were waiting. There’s a photo of me holding up the gold medal on the front steps—nobody in the media realized those were the steps of the police station!

Ross Rebagliati Says: Winning the medal and having it stripped within 24 hours took a massive toll. For ten years after the Olympics, I was in a dark place. Roots flew me around on private jets with Keith Richards, Dan Aykroyd, and supermodels; 15,000 people packed the Toronto Eaton Centre for an autograph signing. But I’d return to my tiny Whistler apartment flat broke because corporate sponsors dropped me over cannabis. I retired the following season.

Tom Ritchie Says: At that press conference in Nagano, you said: “I’m not changing my friends.” From that moment forward, you became Canada’s poster child for cannabis advocacy.

Ross Rebagliati Says: Even in the police cell, I thought: weed is good, I’ve used it for ten years, and eventually it’s going to be legalized. For 25 years, whenever an athlete like Michael Phelps was in the news for weed, I went on NBC to explain why athletes use cannabis because I had nothing to lose. I argued weed was performance-enhancing, family-friendly, and therapeutic, blowing stereotypes out of the water.

Ross Rebagliati Says: Before federal legalization, we operated the Ross’ Gold dispensary in Kelowna, winning Best Dispensary in BC twice. We launched our glass line when Tommy Chong was just getting out of jail for glass bongs. When legalization arrived, Health Canada had rules against celebrity endorsements. My argument was: I’m a cannabis celebrity—without weed, nobody would know my name! Weed came to me.

Tom Ritchie Says: If Health Canada has a problem, they can call me, because I happen to know the regulations quite well! Love the Ross’ Gold logo—a beautiful throwback to the gold medal.

Nagano Till Now & Chris Roussakis (58:04)

Tom Ritchie Says: Chris Roussakis from Phantom Productions reached out on Instagram, and the plan formed to create Nagano Till Now. Let’s bring in Chris Roussakis, co-founder and creative director at Phantom Productions!

Chris Roussakis Says: Nice to be here, guys. Thank you.

Tom Ritchie Says: Chris had been sitting in the green room waiting patiently! Walk us through how this project began with the Sochi beret.

Chris Roussakis Says: During the Sochi Olympics, I posted on Instagram: “They’ve got to bring back the beret! Tag Ross Rebagliati—he rocked it best.” To my surprise, Ross replied! In my head, I thought Ross was a millionaire who wouldn’t give me the time of day, but he was so approachable. We built a relationship over three years on Instagram.

Tom Ritchie Says: Where were you when you realized you had a window to film?

Chris Roussakis Says: I was at the Ottawa airport on my way to Vancouver with my producer. Looking at our commercial production schedule, our last stop was Kelowna, where Ross lives. I messaged Ross right then, and he said, “Sure, let’s figure it out.” We had two weeks to prep, shot the entire documentary in one day in June 2022 on Sony FX6 cinema cameras, and when we got into the edit suite, we knew we had something special.

Tom Ritchie Says: What was the festival circuit experience like?

Chris Roussakis Says: We applied to 11 festivals and got into five, premiering at South by Southwest (SXSW), followed by Munich and the Whistler Film Festival. Because Ross is still on the US no-fly list over cannabis, he couldn’t attend SXSW, but we closed out the festival tour with him at Whistler in December 2023. Last week we held a private screening in Ottawa and packed the theater.

Chris Roussakis Says: We’re currently finalizing distribution deals to make Nagano Till Now available on streaming platforms like Amazon Prime and Apple TV.

Tom Ritchie Says: Everyone needs to see Ross’s story—it’s Canadian snowboarding and cannabis history encapsulated.

Meet & Greet with Ross & CannaKickIt Screening (1:11:46)

Tom Ritchie Says: On May 4th, CannaKickIt is hosting a private screening of Nagano Till Now with Ross and Chris attending, complete with budtender sampling of Ross’ Gold flower!

Ross’ Gold Lineup & Micro-Producer Sourcing (1:12:18)

Tom Ritchie Says: Ross, let’s talk about the Ross’ Gold product lineup: Nagano 98 in Quebec, Black Diamond, Red Chair, Organic Mango Gold…

Ross Rebagliati Says: You got it! Nagano 98 in Quebec; Black Diamond (indica) in BC and Ontario; Red Chair (hybrid named after Whistler’s first chairlift) in BC; and Organic Mango Gold (sativa) in BC. All grown in living soil by top-notch craft micro-cultivators. We’re working on expanding distribution into Ontario through OCS flow-through, and planning a wrapped Mercedes motorhome tour to ski resorts to connect directly with budtenders and consumers.

Tom Ritchie Says: Sounds like an opportunity for a Red Beret SKU!

Ross Rebagliati Says: A Red Beret SKU is making its comeback 100%! [laughs]

Tom Ritchie Says: Chris, we’ve got to get you off to your doctor’s appointment. Gents, it’s been an absolute pleasure having you on. Ross, you’re a fucking legend, dude. Chris, all the best.

Chris Roussakis Says: Thanks, guys.

Ross Rebagliati Says: Thanks, guys!

Mendo Medical Feature (1:18:05)

Tom Ritchie Says: Have you ever considered medical cannabis? You probably should. High Flyer Media has partnered with leading provider Mendo Medical to bring you 15% off your first order using code FLY WITH US! Curated by Jay Schwartz, Mendo ensures exceptional quality. Register today at Mendo Medical with code FLY WITH US.

Wrap Up & Outro (1:18:36)

Tom Ritchie Says: Wow, what a fucking show that was! We could go on for hours.

Wes Bowles Says: There’s definitely an episode down the road. We could even do a Ross’ Gold and Legacies edition on the road!

Tom Ritchie Says: Yeah, you can teach me! [laughs] Ross’ Gold will also be available on thehighflyer.ca for swag and merch.

Tom Ritchie Says: Don’t forget our two giveaways this week: Kintore Coffee (bags of coffee and t-shirt) and CannaKickIt tickets (including the May 4th Nagano Till Now screening). Thanks for joining Legacies, everyone. See you next week!

NOTABLE QUOTES
“I won it, and then the next morning was when this happened. I didn’t get a chance to really process winning the Olympics before I had to start processing losing my medal. By the time I got out of jail, the medal had taken on new meaning—it was a burden to me.” Ross Rebagliati — On the personal burden of the Nagano Olympics controversy.

Jump to 01:28

“I haven’t heard from Health Canada, but the argument at the time was that I was a celebrity and I couldn’t do it. But my angle was that this was a cannabis story from the beginning; if it wasn’t for the weed, no one would know who I was today.” Ross Rebagliati — On celebrity branding regulations and compliance.

Jump to 04:12

“Excise tax relief is not going to solve everything—it is not a magic bullet. Poorly managed operations and a failure to understand retail marketing will sink a company, even with tax cuts.” Tom Ritchie — On Six Sigma operations and excise tax relief.

Jump to 03:35

KEY TAKEAWAYS

✔Ross Rebagliati won Olympic gold in snowboarding at the 1998 Nagano Winter Olympics, then faced international controversy when trace amounts of cannabis were detected, temporarily costing him his medal.
✔Ross transitioned from Olympic athlete to cannabis entrepreneur, founding Ross' Gold Cannabis to leverage his unique positioning at the intersection of sport and cannabis culture.
✔The episode also features discussion of Chris Roussakis and the "Nagano Till Now" documentary exploring the aftermath of the 1998 controversy.
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